Counter the misinformation of evolution


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    I hate it when people quote the Bible. You cannot honestly tell me that the Bible is the Word of God. I can just imagine a bunch of bishops sitting around the table going “No no no…this sounds much better!”


    lol next time somebody quotes the bible tell them to shut up, and check a library, the holy bible is listed under Fantasy/Fiction, while other books ABOUT the bible are under Non-fiction then religion


    There’s no doubt The Bible had ideas from its authors in it. Which is why I just interpret the general message of it, and not word for word. Quoting scripture is a dumb idea.

    T G Geko

    wtf, why cant I see a close up of it? But quoting the bible is okay when its about ethics and religion.

    I just wish that people would figure it out that:
    Religion is for ethics and the spiritual and has no place in the physical world
    Science is for the physical world and has no place in ethics or the spiritual


    People who take the bible literally are hilarious. Taking a translation literally is fucking retarded. Anyone who speaks another language will tell you that while general ideas can be conveyed, specific meaning is impossible to translate. That goes about x 1000 when you’re dealing with ancient languages spoken by ancient cultures. Not only that, but bible translations are usually done with the constant consultation of other translations, as there are all kinds of instances where the meaning is unclear, and there are no more ancient greeks or ancient hebrews around to ask for help. There are many instances in the history of bible translation where blatant mistakes have been passed from translator to translator, including, interestingly, a Latin interpolation about the trinity which never existed in the Greek texts and was proved – centuries ago – to have been added in the dark ages. There are still a few English translations of the bible that include that.

    Even if you do think the bible is the word of god, imagining that your English edition even conveys 50% of the original meaning is foolish beyond belief.


    Deuteronomy 25:11-12

    “When men strive together one with another, and the wife of the one draweth near for to deliver her husband out of the hand of him that smiteth him, and putteth forth her hand, and taketh him by the secrets, then thou shalt cut off her hand, thine eye shall not pity her.”

    If we’re going by the word of the bible, then any time two guys get into a fight and someone’s wife grabs her husband’s opponent by the balls, you must cut off her hand without mercy.

    Yeah, we should definitely live our lives around this amazing piece of text. I’m not even going to go into how to sell your daughter as a slave.


    I thought this was an ad and didn’t bother to look at seriously.


    Caio’s information is mostly correct. Most bibles do base their translation work off of other (poorly translated) translations. However, knowledge of Hebrew and Koine is quite good even in our time. Dig:

    Hebrews were a mostly literate people in ancient times. Their language was and is very slow to change because of this. The Jews carry on the same tradition today of instructing the language of their people. So, modern knowledge of Hebrew is quite good. (But as Caio brought, out many translate according to a tradition or their personal ecclesiology, rather then what the text says.)

    Info about Koine ( Ancient Greek ). The bible was not the only material to be written in Koine. In modern times we have a great deal of information from the Greeks (or Koine speaking people). Using your head you can reason that a great deal of writing comes from that time and ALOT is Koine or is in some form of closely related Koine. Even this aside, a verbatim translation from Greek is not too difficult to read. Especially with even a little knowledge of Koine. In fact, some bibles are used to teach Koine. These are called “ponies” or “trots”. These “ponies” are used because of their accuracy and how readily one can understand idioms and metaphors by use of them. Mind you, I am not talking about a class on religion, only language.

    Amendments by the Catholic church (see Latin Vulgate) and the twisting done by the the dictates of the Sophirim do exist, but can readily be accounted for. (some of this Caio mentioned and was correct in saying)

    Ideas can be translated in to other languages accurately (by a skilled translator). For example: “cutting straight” (verbatim from Koine) and ‘handle correctly’ (translation to English). Translating is really not a difficult thing to do with the knowledge we have today (and half of a brain) . As we mentioned, though, most who translate the bible do not use their skill (if they have any). For instance, about 80% of the KJV reads EXACTLY the same as Tyndale’s translation of the bible. That’s why it says “and with the former translations diligently compared”. They mean they copied most of it. Most today follow a similar silly tradition like the KJV.

    Partially as a result of poor translations from good texts, we have people like WTFBURGERZ who “interpret the general message of it”. In other words ‘use the bible for an excuse for whatever I do, because I say: it told me to do it.’ Most of the wars and bloodshed over the past 1700 years is because of ‘the **cough** bible **cough** said to’. Using this reasoning, I say: ‘All black people are pirates because the book “The gods of Mars” says so!’ If you are going to have a opinion based solely on what you want to do, at least take credit for it, and don’t blame it on a book.

    Many people who believe that the bible is not the word of God have never studied it. These are idiots for simply believing what they were told without doing any REAL research. Most people who believe that the bible IS the word of God, also, have not studied it. These too, are IDIOTS, and in my opinion worse then the former group.


    Deuteronomy contains a law covenant for the Jews. That means the law applied to you, only if you were a Jew or a Jewish proselyte.

    In conclusion, if you to believe something, that is your business. But if you attempt a commentary DO SOME RESEARCH FIRST.

    The Matrix: Rebooted

    “Many people who believe that the bible is not the word of God have never studied it. These are idiots for simply believing what they were told without doing any REAL research.”
    Caio, I appreciate your informed commentary and agree with most of it, but the above quote is kind of a weird opinion.
    There are literally hundreds of religious texts in the world. The safe null hypothesis is that none of them are Truth, with a capital T. A person is not an idiot just because they haven’t studied every single religious text to determine if it is the word of God. Have you studied the Hindu Vedas or the Book of Mormon? The burden of proof is on the believers.


    It must be tough being an under-appreciated scholar there, EvilDon.

    I agree that most people who espouse the bible as infallible truth don’t know it too well. However, there are a good number of people who do know it well, yet pick and choose what they wish to follow and how to interpret it.

    I, for one, was a devout Christian for a long time before I could no longer support the dichotomy in my mind between logic and faith, and can tell you that the old testament is regarded in many circles as an integral part of the bible.

    This is especially true for creationists and others of their ilk, as the creation myths for this particular culture come from this section. Again, many pick and choose which sections to believe, but Deuteronomy was in our congregations bible, and thus to those that consider the bible sacrosanct, is law.

    Indeed, the reason I know of this section of the bible, is that was forced to study it for many wasted Sundays when I could have been watching Football or recovering from a hangover. I have not been surprised to find it the bibles of other denominations, even Catholics.

    I would suggest you take your own advice.


    Let me say this as far as this topic is concerned. Catholics are screwed up. They got it all wrong. I am a Christian meaning I believe in what the Bible says and, more importantly, I have taken Jesus Christ as my personal savior. Catholics are NOT true Christians. Why? Because they believe the works can get you into heaven. Wrong! That’s not what the Bible says. That was added by the Pope and his cronies. Also, the Bible doesn’t say anything about masturbation being a sin. Not one place. This too was another item added to the Bible by the Pope and his buddies. These are just two ways that the Catholics are screwed up.

    Further more, the Bible also says that you should follow the laws of wherever it is you live. This means that if it says that selling your daughter into slavery is wrong in your “land” then it is. Is an “eye for an eye” is wrong then it is. The Bible is NOT meant to be taken litterally you fools. Come on!


    reboot Actually I have studied Hinduism (albeit a small amount, btw, Chukwa is my friend) and teh Mormonz(Young and Smith make me giggle) . But that is beside the point. I was point to the fact that most people simply believe what they are told, for no other reason, they were told, so they believe. And as you said “The burden of proof is on the believers”. Which is why I said “worse then the former group”, they do not care to prove or even support anything (well, perhaps only a couple things) they believe from the book they purport to treasure.

    If one knows anything, a lot or a little about a book, it is still ridiculous to say ‘it’s God’s word’ and disregard bits where you and God don’t see eye to eye. It is then that people use the bible as an excuse for their actions, good or bad. Is it not still hypocritical to ignore “God’s word” as YOU see fit? Right?

    As for good ‘ol Deuteronomy (or second law). Part of the Pentateuch or Torah, written by Moses in 1473 B.C.E. Yes, it is a part of the bible. GOOD JOB! You get a gold star. If Deuteronomy (and the rest of the Mosaic Law) is God’s word then he would want it followed right? Right. So, where are the sacrifices offered for the Day of Atonement? Who offers the sacrifice? Oh, no temple, or even a line of Levi to have a priesthood? Hmmm Why would God not allow people to worship Him in the way he asked? Why would he put aside the law? Do you know where I am going? I doubt it. It is simple, Romans 6:14, 15 (though I would recommend reading the whole book for a better understanding). See? Mosaic law = not for Christians. And if God still wanted the law practiced he would have not have said to stop (cited in the afore mentioned scripture) or he would have not let the temple be destroyed along with the priestly line (the records for it anyways). But that is what the bible says, so, pay you no mind. God was joking when he wrote it right?

    Would you care to offer me to ‘take my own advice’ again? Or perhaps do what you are good at and ‘recover from your hangover’?


    “The Bible is NOT meant to be taken litterally you fools.”

    “I believe in what the Bible says” (I just don’t believe it is real). I had to add to that statement to make them agree with each other.

    tiki god



    Logic and Science are all I have. **Cuddles with logic and science**


    Uh, EvilDon, you got your dates wrong. Deuteronomy is considered (by all modern critics) to have been written sometime in the 7th century BCE. By somebody that wasn’t Moses.

    This would be a similar situation to the 4 Gospels, which were written anywhere from 40-90 years after Jesus died.

    There is the Book of Q, that could quite possibly be Jesus’s own words, but that’s not in the Bible (comprehensively or in context).



    I was going by what the bible says. That the book was written by Moses just before the Jews went in to Canaan.

    Though, I personally doubt the “critics”. Simply because from a historical standpoint the bible is pretty much spot on (for example, see: Nineveh and Belshazzar). And during the reign of Hezekiah the law that Moses wrote was found (again according to the bible). Though, the people then may have not been as scientifically advanced, I think the king could tell the difference between a new scroll and a 800 year old one.

    Interesting points are raised though by the “critics”… but citing them in what I was saying would have not been in line with what I was writing about, presenting the ‘bible is God’s word argument’.

    As for the Gospels the bible is silent on the date of their writing. But even according to the bible, it is not reasonable to conclude that it was a journal kept by the writers. Sometimes expressions are used like “to this day” indicating a passage of time. I think 40 years for the earliest might be a bit high. But as late as 70 after sounds about right for the max.


    Oh and the book of Q was written by John DeLance.


    Buddy, I like ya in the vague sense of trying to point out the fallacies of using the Bible as a literal guide to the universe, but you need to get over your over inflated sense of self.

    A) I’m an atheist. Hardcore. I used to rally against the church before I calmed down and took a stance of tolerance without pushing belief, except when approached through logical discourse.

    B) It is ridiculous that people use the bible as a basis for their lives, yet know very little about it. Never disagreed with you on that fact. I was simply pointing out that there are a number of people who do know the bible, yet still pick and choose, WHICH IS ALSO RIDICULOUS.

    C) —This is where you lost me—

    “If Deuteronomy (and the rest of the Mosaic Law) is God’s word then he would want it followed right?”


    “So, where are the sacrifices offered for the Day of Atonement? Who offers the sacrifice?…”

    Again, EXACTLY!

    “Why would he put aside the law?”

    GENAU! [Got tired of using the same word.]

    It stands to reason that if other parts of the bible are thought to be the literal truth, then these sections of the bible which are often ignored in choosing to lead a life by the bible, should also be followed. They are not. Further leading many who claim to follow the path of the bible to be hypocrites. (Not that it was in doubt. See also: “Do Not Kill” & religiously sanctioned genocide.) Especially seeing as they are still being studied, and are found in contemporary bibles.

    D) I have read the bible, both as a devout follower of Christ (my childhood was not fun), and back in college through religious studies.

    Now, again, you’re losing me here.

    Romans 6 is about not following law (implied human law), denying sin as a master, and being a slave to God. Basically, don’t sin (which is disobey God) and be his slave (though you have free will). Sooooo… do as God says, and being as Moses is said to speak for the ‘Almighty,’ obey Mosaic law.

    Is it being under grace and not law that you refer to in Romans 6:14? Because that means divine grace, which was said to be the only way for mankind to overcome sin, no matter how good a life they lead. As for the law, it means though you may have lead a good life under the law, you still are going to be punished forever unless you accept this particular god.

    E) Yes, I would recommend you take your own advice, and look into your own hubris.

    F) This is getting weird, I’m now arguing with other atheists on My Confined Space, or possibly a very confused Christian. I can’t tell at this point.



    A-C . ok then. 😀

    In the letter to the Romans Paul does mention “implied human law”. But a great deal is about the Mosiac law and what you mentioned as well. Why do I say Mosiac law? Talking about the covenant with Abraham and circumcision and whatnot is part of the human law (laws of the land) makes no sense. Applying it to the Mosaic law does. If I understood you correctly.

    “Is it being under grace and not law that you refer to in Romans 6:14?” Righty. Grace which was shown by the sacrifice and so on… I think we are on the same page with “D”.

    As for “E”. lulz. At least it should be interesting. teeheehee

    “F” Does it matter? I enjoy the mental exercise.


    *hearty handshake*

    Good discourse, sir.


    teeheehee Sentiment returned. 🙂

    tiki god

    what the fuck? civilized discourse on my MCS? This is a truely sad day!

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